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	<title>Comments on: The Broken Promise of Automatic Image Tagging</title>
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	<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/</link>
	<description>The musings of a research software engineer ...</description>
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		<title>By: Andrew Lampert</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4848</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Lampert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Nov 2006 09:37:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4848</guid>
		<description>Nice work Alexei! Looks great from the examples you&#039;ve got in your blog post. I&#039;ll have to spend some time trying it out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice work Alexei! Looks great from the examples you&#8217;ve got in your blog post. I&#8217;ll have to spend some time trying it out.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexei Yavlinsky</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4803</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexei Yavlinsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Nov 2006 07:05:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4803</guid>
		<description>The link in the previous post should have been pointing to &lt;a href=&quot;http://beholdsearch.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-feature.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The link in the previous post should have been pointing to <a href="http://beholdsearch.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-feature.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexei Yavlinsky</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4802</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexei Yavlinsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Nov 2006 07:03:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4802</guid>
		<description>Hi, in response to your comment about the combination of metadata and &#039;automatic&#039; image tags, this is a feature that I&#039;ve been able to add in the past couple of days! Here&#039;s a link to a post that describes the new feature :) Comments and suggestions appreciated. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, in response to your comment about the combination of metadata and &#8216;automatic&#8217; image tags, this is a feature that I&#8217;ve been able to add in the past couple of days! Here&#8217;s a link to a post that describes the new feature <img src='http://www.sgi.nu/diary/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  Comments and suggestions appreciated. Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Lampert</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4736</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Lampert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Nov 2006 05:36:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4736</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the pointers to further information. Nice to see some PhD research actually out there being used in anger! Gives some hope to people like me still in the midst of our own PhD research!! I was interested to see your supervisor is Stefan Rueger -  I remember meeting him a couple of years ago when he was visiting a multimedia research group &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ict.csiro.au&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;where I work&lt;/a&gt;. He even gave &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ict.csiro.au/HAIL/Abstracts/2003-past/StefanRueger.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a seminar&lt;/a&gt; in the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ict.csiro.au/HAIL&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;seminar series&lt;/a&gt; that I co-ordinate. Small world!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the pointers to further information. Nice to see some PhD research actually out there being used in anger! Gives some hope to people like me still in the midst of our own PhD research!! I was interested to see your supervisor is Stefan Rueger &#8211;  I remember meeting him a couple of years ago when he was visiting a multimedia research group <a href="http://www.ict.csiro.au" rel="nofollow">where I work</a>. He even gave <a href="http://www.ict.csiro.au/HAIL/Abstracts/2003-past/StefanRueger.htm" rel="nofollow">a seminar</a> in the <a href="http://www.ict.csiro.au/HAIL" rel="nofollow">seminar series</a> that I co-ordinate. Small world!</p>
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		<title>By: Alexei Yavlinsky</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4721</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexei Yavlinsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Nov 2006 02:26:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4721</guid>
		<description>Hi,

thanks for the feedback! It is the same idea of using a limited annotation vocabulary, but used for the purpose of helping ameliorate poor text metadata in bulk search, rather than suggesting tags to users. Right now automatic annotations are deliberately not combined with text metadata, to demonstrate raw capabilities of the former. You can try how metadata search would perform on its own by using it as a separate search option. We give a short rundown of how the system works &lt;a href=&quot;http://go.beholdsearch.com/about/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; and we even have a &lt;a href=&quot;http://beholdsearch.blogspot.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;blog&lt;/a&gt; for everyone to leave comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>thanks for the feedback! It is the same idea of using a limited annotation vocabulary, but used for the purpose of helping ameliorate poor text metadata in bulk search, rather than suggesting tags to users. Right now automatic annotations are deliberately not combined with text metadata, to demonstrate raw capabilities of the former. You can try how metadata search would perform on its own by using it as a separate search option. We give a short rundown of how the system works <a href="http://go.beholdsearch.com/about/" rel="nofollow">here</a> and we even have a <a href="http://beholdsearch.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">blog</a> for everyone to leave comments.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Lampert</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4720</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Lampert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Nov 2006 22:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4720</guid>
		<description>Hi Alexei,

I had a quick look at Behold - seems a similar idea in terms of classifying images using a limited vocabulary of annotation tags. Is that right? 

I tried &#039;beach&#039; as an example visual search, and was surprised that the first couple of results seem less relevant than later results. Is there any attempt to rank/order the images presented like in text search, or is it simply a set of images with annotations that match the keyword? I was wondering, for example, whether you take into account multiple forms of evidence for image relevance: e.g., your automatic annotations combined with meta-data around the image, plus the image file name or other similar properties.

Thanks for the link.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Alexei,</p>
<p>I had a quick look at Behold &#8211; seems a similar idea in terms of classifying images using a limited vocabulary of annotation tags. Is that right? </p>
<p>I tried &#8216;beach&#8217; as an example visual search, and was surprised that the first couple of results seem less relevant than later results. Is there any attempt to rank/order the images presented like in text search, or is it simply a set of images with annotations that match the keyword? I was wondering, for example, whether you take into account multiple forms of evidence for image relevance: e.g., your automatic annotations combined with meta-data around the image, plus the image file name or other similar properties.</p>
<p>Thanks for the link.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexei Yavlinsky</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4710</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexei Yavlinsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Nov 2006 00:33:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4710</guid>
		<description>Hi, we have now been working for a while on a prototype, proof-of-concept image search engine called &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.beholdsearch.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Behold&lt;/a&gt; that combines statistical image auto-annotation with content based image browsing. It currently indexes over 1 million images from university websites. So far the keywords it can handle are very simple but some can be helpful when extracted html metadata is poor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, we have now been working for a while on a prototype, proof-of-concept image search engine called <a href="http://www.beholdsearch.com" rel="nofollow">Behold</a> that combines statistical image auto-annotation with content based image browsing. It currently indexes over 1 million images from university websites. So far the keywords it can handle are very simple but some can be helpful when extracted html metadata is poor.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Lampert</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4652</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Lampert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Nov 2006 21:21:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4652</guid>
		<description>Yeah - there&#039;s lots of research systems in image retrieval (and more generally multimedia retrieval) that have used input images as a query to find similar images for quite a while now. 

I was actually more impressed by Riya&#039;s work in face recognition for photos than the &quot;likeness-based&quot; search, particularly given it is limited to very constrained domains of application right now.

More generally, I&#039;m just not sure how useful image-input search is. A lot of the time, when I&#039;m searching for an image, I don&#039;t have a prototypical image to use as an input query. Even if I do, I&#039;m not sure that you could adequately find similar images using image processing algorithms (I don&#039;t just want something with similar colouring, contrast etc, but the same subject matter most of the time - and that&#039;s *much* harder to detect). 

But I guess, as you point out, it may have application in some limited domains. Perhaps even the fashion domain it is currently targeted at is one such domain - I don&#039;t know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah &#8211; there&#8217;s lots of research systems in image retrieval (and more generally multimedia retrieval) that have used input images as a query to find similar images for quite a while now. </p>
<p>I was actually more impressed by Riya&#8217;s work in face recognition for photos than the &#8220;likeness-based&#8221; search, particularly given it is limited to very constrained domains of application right now.</p>
<p>More generally, I&#8217;m just not sure how useful image-input search is. A lot of the time, when I&#8217;m searching for an image, I don&#8217;t have a prototypical image to use as an input query. Even if I do, I&#8217;m not sure that you could adequately find similar images using image processing algorithms (I don&#8217;t just want something with similar colouring, contrast etc, but the same subject matter most of the time &#8211; and that&#8217;s *much* harder to detect). </p>
<p>But I guess, as you point out, it may have application in some limited domains. Perhaps even the fashion domain it is currently targeted at is one such domain &#8211; I don&#8217;t know.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff Wilson</title>
		<link>http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/comment-page-1/#comment-4651</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff Wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:46:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sgi.nu/diary/2006/11/16/the-broken-promise-of-automatic-image-tagging/#comment-4651</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.podtech.net/scobleshow/technology/1217/first-demo-of-likecom-a-new-kind-of-search-engine&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Scoble&lt;/a&gt; has video demonstration of a new likeness based search. 

They&#039;ve gone a slightly different route, and rather than use tags to find images, they use an existing image.

The image processing algortihm seems good, but not good enough for general use. However, in the targeted verticals they are using it for ... wow!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.podtech.net/scobleshow/technology/1217/first-demo-of-likecom-a-new-kind-of-search-engine" rel="nofollow">Scoble</a> has video demonstration of a new likeness based search. </p>
<p>They&#8217;ve gone a slightly different route, and rather than use tags to find images, they use an existing image.</p>
<p>The image processing algortihm seems good, but not good enough for general use. However, in the targeted verticals they are using it for &#8230; wow!</p>
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